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 League of Legends
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| Cpt Obvious |
Posted on 24-08-2010 16:12
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 Posts: 1167 Joined: 12.04.08 |
Quote Spaceboy wrote: Well personally I don't find it that fun to play a champion that basically guarantees my team will lose (Eve, Mal.. etc)... sooo.. there's that  Only one like that Eve, even i wont touch her even tho shes fun as sunfire spammer. Others may be bad but not "sure loss" champs. Also i got a problem... cant get enough IP in time or money for RP  |
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| spaceboy |
Posted on 24-08-2010 16:13
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 Posts: 1179 Joined: 06.05.08 |
Yeah that is nice, it was really irritating having to sell your boots, down all the elixirs and re-buy your boots again at end game when you had excess cash 
Behold the wondrous return of Sheriff Pony!
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| wolflordandy |
Posted on 24-08-2010 17:01
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 Posts: 477 Joined: 19.07.08 |
The thing with kennen is, all being well he'll be getting alot more stuns on, so it will be several short stuns, which is more annoying then one long one most of the time. In a team fight with his ulti on, he should get 1 stun on everyone, and a 2nd on whoever he's targeting. Then chain stun through the rest of the targets as he cycles (they should all get a minimum of 4 marks if done perfectly from ulti + w ability) Admitedly when does a team fight go perfectly?  |
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| Cpt Obvious |
Posted on 24-08-2010 17:07
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Posts: 1167 Joined: 12.04.08 |
Urgot confirmed for 3150 ip! I can afford him afterall |
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| tomregev |
Posted on 25-08-2010 01:51
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 Posts: 1021 Joined: 26.06.08 |
Fun fact, Annivia's wall prevent Urgot from switching places.
Edited by tomregev on 25-08-2010 02:16 |
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| wolflordandy |
Posted on 25-08-2010 21:38
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Posts: 477 Joined: 19.07.08 |
Does it stop other stuff like blitzkrank/amumu grab? And does it just make both people bounce into the wall? Another fun fact, prepatch Vlad could go under the wall while a puddle (unsure if its been fixed) |
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| Cpt Obvious |
Posted on 27-08-2010 11:26
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Posts: 1167 Joined: 12.04.08 |
Tier list since urgot update: Changes are mostly because tanky dps builds are the popular deal now. Bolded the most interesting changes * Tier 1: Ezreal, Amumu, Morgana, Garen, Taric, Shen, Kayle * Tier 2: Vladimir, Sion, Annie, Kennen, Kog'Maw , Udyr, Janna, Nasus, Warwick, Tristana, Nidalee, Shaco, Ashe, Sivir, Zilean, Xin Zhao, Veigar, Rammus, Pantheon. * Tier 3: Poppy, Twitch, Heimerdinger, Kassadin, Gragas, Twisted Fate, Anivia, Singed, Akali, Mordekaiser, Olaf, Alistar, Katarina, Yi, Galio, Gangplank, Nunu, Karthus. * Tier 4: Malphite, Ryze, Jax, Soraka, Blitzcrank, Corki, Fiddlesticks * Hard to place on a team: Urgot, Eve, Teemo, Mal'zahar, Tryndamere, Cho'Gath, Mundo Edited by Cpt Obvious on 27-08-2010 11:27 |
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| tomregev |
Posted on 27-08-2010 12:59
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Posts: 1021 Joined: 26.06.08 |
Don't know where you got that from but veigar, kog and trist in tier2, really? |
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| Cpt Obvious |
Posted on 27-08-2010 14:23
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Posts: 1167 Joined: 12.04.08 |
I got it from LoL related forums i visit, its legit. Kogmaw is high cause the current metagame is heavily about tanks and bulky dps, kog can counter all the high hp targets with just bloodrazor thanks to Q now giving attack speed, that lets him build tanky after just one dps item while still making him a threat. And Veigar is the best mage counter in the game. Tristana is high i guess cause she has the best range and one of the best damage of all ranged carries. |
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| Cpt Obvious |
Posted on 27-08-2010 14:26
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Posts: 1167 Joined: 12.04.08 |
Upcoming patch notes: Akali * Fixed a display error with Twin Disciplines and death recap. Alistar * Unbreakable Will o Corrected the tooltip: it removes all crowd control not all debuffs. * Pulverize's tooltip corrected to not imply that enemies do not take damage until they land. Amumu * Curse of the Sad Mummy o Corrected the debuff tooltip: it renders units unable to attack or move. * Cursed Touch o Magic Resistance Reduction reduced to 15/25/35 from 20/30/40. Annie * Corrected the buff tooltip on Molten Shield so it correctly implies that all attackers receive magic damage. Cho'Gath * Fixed a display error with Vorpal Spikes and death recap. * Feral Scream o Reduced the silence duration to 2/2.25/2.5/2.75/3 seconds from 2/2.5/3/3.5/4 seconds o Reduced the cooldown duration to 14 seconds from 16 seconds Corki * Attack Range increased to 550 from 500. * Gatling Gun o Range increased to 850 from 750. * Missile Barrage o Reduced reload time to 10 from 14. * Attack Speed Per Level increased to 2.3 from 1.86 Dr. Mundo * Infected Cleaver o Cost changed to 50/60/70/80/90 from 30/50/70/90/110 o Dr. Mundo is healed for half of the ability cost when the cleaver strikes a target. * Burning Agony o Cost lowered to 20/25/30/35/40 from 20/27.5/35/42.5/50 * Masochism o Cost changed to 25/35/45/55/65 from 15/30/45/60/75 * Sadism o Returns 40/55/70 percent of Mundo's health instead of 50/50/50. Ezreal * Base damage reduced to 45 from 47.6 * Damage Per Level reduced to 2.6 from 3 * Attack Speed Per Level reduced to 2.8 from 3.22 * Mystic Shot o Mystic Shot damage reduced to 35/55/75/95/115 from 40/65/90/115/140 * Essence Flux o Essence Flux damage reduced to 70/115/160/205/250 from 80/130/180/230/280 * Arcane Shift o Arcane shift damage reduced to 65/110/155/200/245 from 75/125/175/225/275 Gangplank * Fixed a display error with Grog Soaked Blade and death recap. * Fixed a bug where Gangplank's passive would be replaced with the Grog Soaked Blade debuff text when struck by another Gangplank. Gragas * Fixed a display error with the tooltip on Barrel Roll's self buff. Heimerdinger * UPGRADE!!! o Corrected the tooltip: the slow is actually 20/25/30 not 25/30/35. Kassadin * Nether Blade's level up tooltip correctly states the increased mana cost. Karthus * Wall of Pain's level up tooltip correctly states the increased slow amount. Kayle * Reckoning's debuff and death recap tooltips have had erroneous mentions of attack speed slows removed. Kog'Maw * Living Artillery's buff on Kog'Maw correctly states that the increased cost per stack is 40, rather than 50. Malzahar * Call of the Void o Delay between cast and effects reduced to .25 seconds from .4 seconds. o Cooldown reduced to 9 seconds from 10 seconds. o Mana cost reduced to 80/88/96/104/112 from 90/100/110/120/130. * Null Zone o Mana cost reduced to 80/95/110/125/140 from 90/105/120/135/150. o Null Zone no longer places a blank buff on Malzahar. * Nether Grasp o Now suppresses summoner spells in addition to stunning the target. o Range increased to 750 from 650. Master Yi * Wuju Style tooltip simplified. Nasus * Fury of the Sands buff on Nasus no longer incorrectly states that it grants increased attack speed. Nidalee * Cougar form's tooltip correctly mentions the 10% bonus dodge chance Nidalee gains in Cougar Form. * Corrected a display error with Takedown and death recap. Pantheon * Corrected a display error with Pantheon's auto attack and death recap. Sivir * Typos corrected in the level up tooltips for Spell Shield and Boomerang Blade. Soraka * Starcall o Debuff placed now correctly states that it can stack up to 20x. Tristana * Rocket Jump o Debuff placed now correctly states the slow amount. Twitch * Spray and Pray o Buff no longer incorrectly states that he does reduced damage during Spray and Pray. Veigar * Fixed a typo in Event Horizon. Warwick * Blood Scent o Blood Scent is now a toggle. Items * Sheen, Lich's Bane and Trinity Force's "reservoir" system removed. These items will now strictly respect the cooldown time between procs. * Sheen, Lich's Bane and Trinity Force's cooldowns reduced to 2 second delays between procs from 3 seconds. * Spirit Visage redesigned o Comprised of Null-Magic Mantle, Ruby Crystal, and 375 recipe cost. o 30 Magic Resist o 200 Health o UNIQUE Passive: Reduces ability cooldowns by 12% and increases your healing and regeneration effects on yourself by 20%. General * Hyper-Kinetic Position Reverser, Infinite Duress and Nether Grasp now properly suppress and stun their targets. * Towers currently attacking a champion will not respond to further calls for help from other champions. Mundo buffs <3 (healing over 100% hp with ulti + spirit visage? )Malzahar buffs <3 (MASSIVE range on ulti + supression, i can see Malz climbing up tier lists) |
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| spaceboy |
Posted on 27-08-2010 14:42
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Posts: 1179 Joined: 06.05.08 |
Well I think Kog and Trist are both very good, being able to poke at range is always useful... I agree with querying Veigar though (Edit: actually Obvious is right now I give it some thought..this is after all a list for draft mode and he IS a great counter to mages, so it makes sense). I'm also a lil surprised Sivir is still considered as good as that, although maybe she just hasn't been thought about for a while as she hasn't changed in ages. I guess the changes to Kennen actually had some effect then? Haven't seen him in game since the patch so haven't had a chance to see  The tier list, with explanations, can be found here. Like the look of those patch notes Obvious (Corki/Mundo buffs!).. you're right about Mal, he might start looking useful if they keep buffing the range on his ult.. I mean he's getting to the point now where he can use it in team fights be safely positioned behind his tanks That said he's still got the worst lane control of anyone in the game so he may still need some more love to be properly viable!
Edited by spaceboy on 27-08-2010 15:00 Behold the wondrous return of Sheriff Pony!
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| tomregev |
Posted on 27-08-2010 16:26
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Posts: 1021 Joined: 26.06.08 |
Kog is 3 at best, I love him but even ad annie can gank him with ease, he's not a tank counter since getting bloodrazor on him means you do zero damage outside of your W and if you're in W range and they don't kill you then they're just bad. There's nothing trist does that ashe doesn't do better, there's nothing veigar does that annie doesn't do better. Also after another look warwick isn't 2 either, sure he's awesome early but at mid game he becomes a non issue. The blood scent toggle is a step in the right direction though, right now it's just a giant neon sign that says "WARNING WARNING WARWICK'S AROUND". Once suppression for his ult comes in he'll be much better. Edited by tomregev on 27-08-2010 16:44 |
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| spaceboy |
Posted on 27-08-2010 16:44
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Posts: 1179 Joined: 06.05.08 |
Surely Kog can kite like a beast what with his range and all? His W range is still better than pretty much any other ranged carry and if he's positioned to hit the enemy tanks (and thus far away from the enemy damage) he should be able to avoid being focused? When he gets bloodrazer can't he potentially do like 10% of the enemy hit points per hit? I don't think there's a better counter to health stacking in the game right now. Trist is more than competitive with Ashe late game, she's got better range and petter positional ability due to rocket jump for team fights... add red buff to that mix (meaning Ashe's innate slow no longer means anything) and I think Trist is actually better. The only advantage Ashe has is the ability to use her arrow for initiating.. it's a close call but personally I agree that Trist edges it. The one thing Veigar does better than Annie? Counter Annie!.. not to mention any other high level caster who he can potentially end up one shotting with his ult late game. This is for draft pick remember.. no one's suggesting that you'd pick Veigar first and build your team around him, but if the other team picks Annie/Vlad/Ryze off the bat then I can see Veigar being a worthwhile counter. Oh hey I forgot Warwick.. jungling wins games pure and simple, he's the best jungler in the game and can potentially run the opposition jungler out of the game entirely if the opposing team doesn't take active steps to stop him. I agree that late game he'll be on the wane.. but most high level games are over after about 30 minutes anyway so that doesn't seem to mater that much. So yeah early he's an amazing jungler/ganker.. mid he's an effective lifesteal tank/initiator ... late game you've already won, that's the idea
Edited by spaceboy on 27-08-2010 16:48 Behold the wondrous return of Sheriff Pony!
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| tomregev |
Posted on 27-08-2010 16:56
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Posts: 1021 Joined: 26.06.08 |
If you're kiting with W you're wasting half the duration and get like 5 hits at best. Trist's range only becomes a factor late game and even then it's just a little more than volley. Her W is purely an escape or a very risky chasing tool for the 2 guys who got away, using it to get in and ult someone into your team is good in theory but then you're left with no escape in the middle of the enemy team. Shes' a lot more gold dependent so if you're having a bad early game she'll remain useless for the rest of the game. By the time veigar's ult reaches annie, who should never be in range of it anyways, he'll have a stun fire bear clawing his face off. If you want a true anti mage kass is much better, he has a silence and can get to the back lines, burst the casters and disappear before they know what the fuck happened. There were so many times veigars though they have me with their silly prison thing only for me to ult out and tear them up. Cleansing out of it as a powerballing rammus for a taunt and ult rape is just as funny. |
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| spaceboy |
Posted on 27-08-2010 17:37
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Posts: 1179 Joined: 06.05.08 |
If you're wasting most of Kog's W kiting at least you're not dead Plus kiting's always worthwhile as the other team is doing no damage and being pulled out of position while they do it. Trist is primarily gonna be your late game carry, that's the role she fills, so the fact her range only really kicks in late isn't a huge deal as that's when she's supposed to step up anyway. Also in this hypothetical 1v1 where Trist and Ashe battle it out at range Trist will still win as volley isn't Ashe's primary source of dps.. yeah she can volley Trist once as she rushes to engage..but she'll take another 2-3 hits before she gets in range of her autoattack (with Trist maxing out at 2.5 attacks per second) and late game that probably means she's already dead You do know that rocket jump resets on kills AND assists yeah? During the second half of team fights when everyone's softened up (which they will be because you've been shelling them from super range from safety) it's a devastating tool for ducking in and out of fights as long as you're paying attention to when an enemy's going to drop. I do agree she's gold dependant though.. but to be honest so are all the carries, and that's why she gets a solo/mid. I'm not gonna go massively out of my way to defend Veigar.. truth be told I pretty much hate him and think in general he sucks But I still think if he wants to get his ult off on Annie..and spends his time concentrating on doing that then he should be able to seriously cramp her style. For one thing all he has to do is stun her once (and people DO walk into that stun, the out edge of which has got to be as far as max tibbers range?) then he can just walk up and do what he wants to her... he could use flash to get in and blast her.. not to mention if she's going to the extreme of holding tibbers stun specifically back to kill Veigar then he's already done his job
Edited by spaceboy on 27-08-2010 17:38 Behold the wondrous return of Sheriff Pony!
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| tomregev |
Posted on 27-08-2010 18:05
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Posts: 1021 Joined: 26.06.08 |
Kog tries to kite, no one follows since the threat is gone. I'm not talking about a 1v1 duel betweentrist and ashe, just think who brings more to a team. Ashe mass slows with volley, stuns with R and has a built in clairvoyance when you're not fighting. Trist just shoots stuff. I know the cooldown resets on a kill, that's not reliable at all. That one guy you think is going to drop might have more resist than you think, that guy might have flash/exhaust, etc... I brought the gold thing because it's easier to deny her farming than other range dps since her early game is so weak. Almost all mid champs will push her out of lane. Again I'm not talking about a 1v1 showdown, veigar brings a shitty half stun and a single target nuke to his team, annie brings an aoe stun nuke, stronger burst an an ability to tank towers. |
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| spaceboy |
Posted on 27-08-2010 18:52
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Posts: 1179 Joined: 06.05.08 |
How is the Kog threat gone? If you keep running off when they're not following that's not kiting  If they don't follow you then you just stay at your max range doing damage. Even if they only have to force you to kite for 6 seconds out of every 10, can't remember what the cooldown on W is, that still seems worthwhile to me and in a team fight it's unlikely they're going to be disciplined as a team only to bother chasing you when your W's up.Trist just shoots stuff the way Annie just does burst! She can supply constant dps at a range that no one else can in the game and most importantly stay alive when doing it. Ashe has to be a lot more careful positioning-wise in team fights as her range isn't long enough to get in and autoattack reliably without being focused and killed so a lot of the time she's forced to just volley at range.. and the dps just from volley doesn't amount to much (even if it does slow which is nice, but not that critical for me). So yeah Ashe does add a bunch of extra utility..but she just doesn't carry anywhere near as hard as Trist, and that's her primary role in the team With regard to Rocket Jump; it may not be 100% reliable.. but it's still pretty damn useful unless you're constantly miscalculating and you're smart Tom you can do it! Also it potentially allows you to snowball and go on a chasing/killing spree if the other team breaks. It's certainly al a hell of a lot more reliable than Ashe's escape mechanism anyway... I don't think Trist's early game is THAT weak, it just varies with matchups.. yeah she's fucked against a Vlad or Heimer (pre nerf anyway).. but who isn't? Other than that she's pretty solid, at least to the extent that Ashe is these days if that's the comparison we're making. In Annie vs Veigar comparison I think you're forgetting that I'm not advocating Veigar as a the primary mage but as a counter to casters such as Annie in the first place. It doesn't matter if Annie adds more to the team, well of course she does that's why you'd pick her first! But if you want to take that stuff away from the enemy team you wouldn't be totally insane to pick Veigar... they're totally different roles and the Kassadin comparison made a lot more sense. Behold the wondrous return of Sheriff Pony!
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| tomregev |
Posted on 27-08-2010 21:45
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Posts: 1021 Joined: 26.06.08 |
You run, they go back to doing their own thing, you move back into range, they force you back again, all that time you get one or two shots off. I tried the kog bloodrazor things enough times to know it just doesn't work as well as it sounds and it's a silly gimmick. Trist only starts doing decent damage when she has infinity and a bloodthirster, this takes a long time and you were the one who said pro games are decided at the 20 minutes mark. She's easy as hell to shut down at mid by almost every other mid champion- kat, malzahar, vlad, heimer, ez, gragas, galio, kayle, morgana, good zileans, all will force her off lane by poking her to near death. If she buys lifesteal first to try shooting creeps to heal she's pushed up and can be ganked easily. Both trist and ashe aren't really strong in the current meta game, but at least one of them can still bring some utility after being shut down at mid. I know Fe's video is fun to watch but veigar is not a one shot machine. to be as effective of an anti caster as you make him be he need to farm every single creep in his lane, half the creeps in his teammate's lane and about 2 jungles worth of teemo mushrooms. When in a real game did you see a veigar effectively shut down enemy casters? [small]Also ap yi sucks [/small] |
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| spaceboy |
Posted on 27-08-2010 22:27
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Posts: 1179 Joined: 06.05.08 |
Well you've played more Kog than me (I played one game ) so I'll take your word for it.. but surely there must be some reason the pros disagree with you Well I said pro games tend to end around 30 minutes.. which is close enough to where Trist is coming into her own for her to be a factor in a potentially deciding team fight. All it takes is the game to drag on a little bit more and she starts cleaning house.. also ideally you'd want to build your team with at least one late game hero just so you've covered in the eventuality that it does go longer and I think she stacks up well against other heroes of that ilk. I'm really surprised you find yourself so consistently shut out by some of those champions Tom I have to say. Vlad.. fine.. Heimer.. obviously (although now you could probably take him)... EZ has to be very daring/aggressive or very good surely as you can just hide behind your creeps and from that position you can harass him better than he can harass you (assuming he's not going AP).. Gragas I imagine is hard... Kayle, fair enough (although no one at our crummy elo seems to even play her, let alone put her mid)... Morgana shouldn't be a problem at all due to use of the creep line (not to mention her spell shield does nothing to protect against your physical attacks and she can't help but push a lane so you can lifesteal all you want)... Zilean... never played one, I'd say go aggressive early and you can probably kill him and force him out of lane before his bombs become too much of a problem... I'd also say generally you don't have to worry too much about pushing your lane up at mid with Trist (assuming you're running a mixture of flash/ghost/cleanse) as you've got a nice escape mechanic .. just need to ward up to avoid ganks, so if you need to lifesteal from the creeps I think that's fine. Not to mention a solo lane where you can usually push as hard as you want regardless assuming you're against 2. Veigar may not one shot you but as a squishy caster he WILL on average take off a 1/2 to 3/4 of your hit points in one shot with his ult.... which is basically enough to put you out of a fight right there. AP yi rules! Behold the wondrous return of Sheriff Pony!
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| Cpt Obvious |
Posted on 28-08-2010 01:11
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Posts: 1167 Joined: 12.04.08 |
guy from Gamefaqs has a lot of nice jungling guides for anyone whos interested. http://www.youtub...onewall008 |
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