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 I guess sick was right.
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| Exxy |
Posted on 03-03-2010 08:41
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 Posts: 266 Joined: 10.12.09 |
In an article on Onlinegamer.se, Gryzor (ex-admin on ETF2L with strong connections to the AC team there) admitted to having gotten the danish div6-player eX.Quad banned intentionally, even though no cheat was ever found on the player. This article pretty much shows how incompitent the AC team (or as sick refered to them: "Invisible AC-Admins with a banhammer".) can really be. To sum it up for the people who can't be bothered reading the article: Gryzor recorded a random demo on a public, had the name eX.Quad, played as normal and got some sick shots I guess, sent it to the admin squad, Quad got banned because Gryzor convinced them he was cheating. So Quad was the involuntary victim of an experiment to test the credibility of the AC team, and quite blatantly proved that the AC team isn't as reliable as people thought. Edited by Exxy on 03-03-2010 08:42  |
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| sick-lizard |
Posted on 03-03-2010 09:20
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 Posts: 1672 Joined: 09.07.06 |
its quite sad, I hope the league get some anti cheat software to be honest or at least make the process a bit more transparent. The demo I have seen in Quads case is far to short to be used as the sole basis to ban from a league, maybe the league will be more forth coming with some evidence we have not been privy to so far. (although this would go against the leagues policy of not showing evidence, which we don't do either and perhaps we should if requested by players in the future as its not fare to the concerned players banned and unable to see why, unless its a blatant cheat. Edited by sick-lizard on 03-03-2010 09:27 |
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| Exxy |
Posted on 03-03-2010 09:57
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Posts: 266 Joined: 10.12.09 |
Quote sick-lizard wrote: its quite sad, I hope the league get some anti cheat software to be honest or at least make the process a bit more transparent. The demo I have seen in Quads case is far to short to be used as the sole basis to ban from a league, maybe the league will be more forth coming with some evidence we have not been privy to so far. (although this would go against the leagues policy of not showing evidence, which we don't do either and perhaps we should if requested by players in the future as its not fare to the concerned players banned and unable to see why, unless its a blatant cheat. I agree with this. They should make some .avi's of what the AC team considers "Haxing" and actually put it on the forums for the people to see. If it's blatant hax (like speedhack) then just post a 5 second clip of the guy playing solly and outrunning his scouts to mid, simple as that. |
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| Mr G |
Posted on 03-03-2010 10:16
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 Posts: 696 Joined: 09.07.06 |
Quote Exxy wrote: Gryzor recorded a random demo on a public, had the name eX.Quad, played as normal and got some sick shots I guess, sent it to the admin squad, Quad got banned because Gryzor convinced them he was cheating. steamid from console is a must for a proper demo other wise just a name is nothing to prove who that person is or the account being used, really basic form of admin procedure. |
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| Exxy |
Posted on 03-03-2010 11:20
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Posts: 266 Joined: 10.12.09 |
Quote Mr G wrote: Quote Exxy wrote: Gryzor recorded a random demo on a public, had the name eX.Quad, played as normal and got some sick shots I guess, sent it to the admin squad, Quad got banned because Gryzor convinced them he was cheating. steamid from console is a must for a proper demo other wise just a name is nothing to prove who that person is or the account being used, really basic form of admin procedure. After re-reading the article, I misunderstood it due to the translation being a bit tacky. What he did was go to a public and spec Quad playing and then sent it on after that. |
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| sick-lizard |
Posted on 03-03-2010 11:33
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Posts: 1672 Joined: 09.07.06 |
when viewing the demo at no point did i see the status command issued to console. In my eyes it could have been anyone using quads name, unless I'm missing something unless you type status recording a pov demo you will never get the unique id of the player being viewed |
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| spaceboy |
Posted on 03-03-2010 11:58
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 Posts: 1179 Joined: 06.05.08 |
Though the results were interesting I've got to say this experiment seems to have been pretty cack-handedly put into action. At the very least Gryzor should have asked Quad's permission to use him to continue his self-serving war on the ETF2L admins. If Quad had agreed they then should have documented the endeavour ahead of time so that at this point they'd at least have a higher chance of proving his innocence. I'd also like to know the exact particulars of how Gryzor gave the demo to the AC team.. because there's a huge difference between him putting it up and neutrally saying "This has been sent to me by a pub community who would like it checked out" and "I Gryzor stake my integrity on the fact that this demo shows that this guy is blatantly hacking!". If there was any recommendation from the guy that he personally thought the demo showed hacks then it kinda invalidates the experiment as I can easily imagine a scenario where the current AC team would defer to Gryzor's greater level of experience in the realms of cheat spotting. In other words they could easily have looked at it and seen nothing suspicious but felt that if Gryzor was so sure then he must know what he's talking about. It's also worth bearing in mind that strictly speaking the fact that Gryzor took a random demo of Quad playing and submitted it doesn't technically prove that he wasn't hacking in that clip. It just means that Gryzor doesn't think he was hacking in that clip.. while the AC admins did. As such there's no guarantee that the guy will be unbanned regardless of this information coming out. Having said the above though, if it's true that this really was the footage that got him banned, then personally I can't see anything suspicious enough to base a ban on... but then I don't have any great knowledge regarding hackers or the spotting thereof so what do I know  One thing I would say though is that I'm certain that if the same footage had been put forward by JH or one of the other Div 1 snipers that no one would have called hax.. but as it's some guy nobody's heard of in Div 5 it's easier to jump to that conclusion. At the end of the day the most worrying aspect of this is that if this is the standard of evidence needed to get someone banned then I can only fear for Exxy's future in TF2 
Edited by spaceboy on 03-03-2010 12:00 Behold the wondrous return of Sheriff Pony!
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| Humi |
Posted on 03-03-2010 13:30
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 Posts: 208 Joined: 14.02.08 |
Banning someone just because of one single demo which is not that dodgy is really too quick in my opinion. Maybe the AC team should put him on some watchlist, so they check his team's results more often or spontaneously demand demos to further investigate. |
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| Exxy |
Posted on 03-03-2010 14:00
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Posts: 266 Joined: 10.12.09 |
Quote uberhomer wrote: Banning someone just because of one single demo which is not that dodgy is really too quick in my opinion. Maybe the AC team should put him on some watchlist, so they check his team's results more often or spontaneously demand demos to further investigate. Thing is, that is how they have operated several times, from a single demo. I know that alot of cases has used several demos (abra, kondor, payard are some examples where they used almost an entire season of footage), but alot of cases are just 1 demo and then the ammount of accusations pretty much. So by the formula that ETF2L seems to be using, Icchan, Me and Several more lower div players should be lifetime banned. |
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